Why do so many atheists bring up the suffering of others, and yet do little to relieve that suffering?

2012-05-20 1:21 am
So many atheists seem to use the suffering of others as a weapon. In their mind suffering is some kind of "proof" that God does not exist, even though its existence says nothing about Him at all. Yet according to statistics very few actually try to ease that suffering. The largest group on the planet which contributes to disaster and starvation relief around the globe has always been the average Joe Christian contributing what they can. Atheists on the other hand are fond of pointing to contributions by wealthy atheists as if those contributions were actually coming from them.

One of Ben Franklin's adages is "Well done is better than well said." While the question I asked has always bothered me, I just want to add my own "Well done!" to all of those who do volunteer to help others or to ease their suffering.
更新1:

Satan: a non answer

更新2:

Eddie J: LOL! You obviously did not read the question. I actually used what you said as an example of what atheists say.

更新3:

dead fundie: you conveniently leave out that perhaps pain, suffering and death are part of a plan that you just do not understand.

更新4:

Stacie: Good for you! Keep it up... it is important. When I have asked similar questions in the past I actually had atheists reply that they did not give a hoot about others. Their money was their money and they were going to use it for themselves

更新5:

Gazoo: read my response do dead fundie.

更新6:

Luna: What gold is that? The Catholic Church runs more organizations to help the poor than any other organization in the world including the United Nations. What have you done?

更新7:

alwbsk: Wow! Thank you for affirming my point!

更新8:

Caesar: I am not familiar with the Yakusa.... nor did I say that no atheists contribute.... many do. I was taking about those who use the suffering of others as a weapon but they themselves do nothing to ease that suffering. What Ben Franklin's religious views were have nothing to say about the truth of the quote which I cited. The question was not about Ben Franklin.

更新9:

Loosey: You should try to take a "Reading for Comprehension" class. It will help you in the 8th grade.

更新10:

Zapoid: Thank you for affirming one of my points. What have YOU done?

更新11:

Everard: Wow... a lot of anger there. Did I hit a little close to home? I take it that means you yourself have done nothing?

更新12:

Fabian & Envy: Thank you for your help of others. If everyone did as you do the world would be a much better place.

更新13:

Bono: My point is that those who bring up this argument are generally NOT the ones who actually help others. The argument itself is absurd. I guess it never dawned on you that imperfection could be part of God's perfect plan? Without first learning the opposites of pain, suffering and death no one could ever learn true self-less love.

更新14:

silly: Many do. Do you?

更新15:

Ace: At best you can say that you do not understand it. Read my response to Bono. If you want more detail I would be glad to give it to you.

更新16:

Mikey: I agree with you on many counts. Certainly there are many believers who have a distorted view. The folks at Westboro spring to mind. And certainly they are all human beings and subject to the same follies of all humans. But it seems it is always the good Christians who have led the drive to help others.

更新17:

Magpie: I have not heard Christians say that it was God's job to ease the suffering of others. That was a task He assigned to man. Are you at all aware at how many Christians are part of the Red Cross? Certainly it is not part of any one religious faith, but the Red Cross is the outlet by which a huge number of Christians donate time and money. The largest single organization which runs by far the most organizations to help others is the Roman Catholic Church.

更新18:

Daddy: Thank you. The fact is that everyone has heard of the contributions of Oprah Winfrey or Warren Buffet..... they went on TV to make the donations. It made their ultimate goal not their helping of others, but rather to gain fame as being generous. A billion dollar contribution from Buffet would be like a $10.00 donation from the average citizen.

回答 (20)

2012-05-20 1:42 am
✔ 最佳答案
The greatest measurable and lasting joy known to the human mind is helping out others. By the sheer fact that this brain buzz and high level of personal happiness is rewarded to the charitable, the act becomes off-set by the personal reward.

This is why many godless philanthropists have no problem living a life of sin and iniquity while they "make up for it" by giving to the less fortunate. In their mind it is how to be able to look in the mirror and not see a complete scumbag looking back at them.

When charity becomes vanity, the one gaining the most from the charity becomes arguable. When charity is an act of selfless love for God, the removal of vanity brings equality. You know in your heart what you are doing is by the power of God and not you. This is freedom. Charity is no longer a drug, it is the natural act of a saved soul.

Great question. Well framed.
2012-05-20 1:23 am
Because we don't claim to be omniscient and omnipotent.
2012-05-20 1:26 am
Funny you would quote the least religious of our founders. He attended Hellfire Club meetings in England. This was the group that Anton LeVey used as a partial model for the Church of Satan.

Mostly what we are pointing out is that if we were omnipotent and not a prick, we could and would change things.
2012-05-20 1:25 am
The existence of suffering proves that either god is not all-powerful, or he wants people to suffer. My efforts to alleviate human suffering are irrelevant. Red herring.

Edit: If it's part of a plan, the plan includes human suffering. Therefore, god still wants people to suffer, if only for some greater good.
2012-05-20 1:29 am
The inventor of the polio vaccine, Jonas Salk, was an atheist. I think that trumps a lot of hypocrites praying in their multi-million dollar church once in a while when it suits their schedule. Just for example.

EDIT:

Your comment: "Zapoid: Thank you for affirming one of my points. What have YOU done?"

Reply: I've done plenty, actually, but as scripture tells us, we are not to be exalted in our own good deeds. As for your own self-righteousness, why would you think that bullying and insulting people would attract more folks to your way of seeing things? Wise up. Kindness and compassion for others may not come easily, but it is ALWAYS possible. You have no valid excuse for not trying harder. Have a nice day, if you can.
2012-05-20 1:24 am
A weapon? Sorry, didn't know we were so iniquitous as to advocate open warfare too.
2012-05-20 1:26 am
You're right. We should rob the Catholic church and give the gold to the poor.
2012-05-20 1:25 am
I don't remember claiming that I did more than Christians. I do remember saying that instead of praying for people when they are going through a tragedy, I try to help them through it. And yes, that is true.
2012-05-20 1:35 am
" In their mind suffering is some kind of "proof" that God does not exist,"

It's proof that He doesn't exist in the way His followers claim He does.

"even though its existence says nothing about Him at all"

It says that He is either not omnipotent or He's not omnibenevolent.


"he largest group on the planet which contributes to disaster and starvation relief around the globe has always been the average Joe Christian :

Lie. That would be the Red Cross, which is a secular organization, not a Xtian one.
2012-05-20 1:32 am
Red Herring fallacy: The point isn't why don't atheists lend a hand, the point IS why doesn't God?

Also, these "statistics" you have mean absolutely nothing. You can't even provide a credible source ("Answers in Genesis" is not a credible source). I swear, Christians can't wrap their heads around what constitutes facts or evidence.

"Two hands working can do more than a thousand clasped in prayer."

EDIT: Ya know what, your point is moot when you can't even prove this god exists. Why bother...
2012-05-20 1:34 am
>you conveniently leave out that perhaps pain, suffering and death are part of a plan that you just do not understand

That sounds like a horrible method of carrying out a plan and I can not think of any benevolent God that would intentionally cause people to suffer for any reason at all.

>Without first learning the opposites of pain, suffering and death no one could ever learn true self-less love.
That's actually not true at all.
You don't have to be deprived of something to learn its true value, thus making your argument moot and fallacious.

Although that was blatantly obvious from your wall of generic and fallacious responses.
2012-05-20 1:30 am
It's not like we don't do anything. I'm atheist and I do a lot of community service and help a lot of people unlike people like you who probably only help your own relgion and don't care about those outside your own personal bubble.

Saying we don't help others is highly descriminating and those "statistics" were probably made up by people just like you. You should be careful what you say, because if there was a God, he'd probably be shaking his head at you right now.
2012-05-20 1:32 am
Most atheists I know are volunteers helping their communities. Since there isn't an atheist church however, it is difficult to say atheists are doing this or that to end suffering of any kind. There are a couple of organizations that are atheist and have done charitable things. http://www.christianpost.com/news/atheist-sets-up-religion-free-fund-for-haiti-relief-43368/
Atheists do their share of giving.
2012-05-20 1:31 am
i volunteer with Big Brothers Big Sisters, don't tell me i don't do nice things
2012-05-20 1:30 am
"So many atheists seem to use the suffering of others as a weapon"
What a load of Drama Queen boolshyt.

Where did you get those stats from?
Your lower orifice or your pastor?

"I just want to add my own "Well done!" to all of those who do volunteer to help others or to ease their suffering."
Oh, bully for you...
I don't need your permission to feel good.

You have NO frigging idea what I or any other person has ever done.

What do YOU actually do.. ?
Tithe to your church?
How much of that money actually goes to helping people?
How much is spent propping up the building or the pastor?

Sanctimonious finger-pointing judgmental xians give me the irrits...
~
2012-05-20 1:29 am
Where do you get off accusing atheists in particular of causing suffering, you bigoted brainwashed twit.
2012-05-20 1:29 am
I really dont know where you get your data..for example the Yakuza on Japan i am sure they are not Joe Christians.

"I have found Christian dogma unintelligible. Early in life, I absenteed myself from Christian assemblies."
Ben Franklin
2012-05-20 1:28 am
We use suffering of others for about the only thing it's good for: to help others see reason. That's not a weapon, that's a gift to mankind.

EDIT: You're welcome! If people are suffering, it's at least nice to see that their pain produces something positive.
2016-02-24 10:01 am
Interesting that some of the Xians here claim no Christian has ever said such a thing but only atheist trolls do. Obviously, we are reading different message boards and know different Christians. Some Christians most definitely do seem to take delight in thinking of various people suffering for all eternity while they live on in paradise. Some so much as say they will be "up there laughing" at those of us burning in hell. What kind of heaven would that be? What kind of Christians? They do their own religion a great disservice when they say things like this, but they do show their true colors. Much, but not all, of religion is about feeling "special", "better than", etc. Many people really are only Christian in name, are just "cultural Christians", and have no idea what it even means to be "Christ-like", nor care to attempt to be better people. And even some of those very nice Christians can get downright ugly if you scratch the surface of their belief, if you challenge them to really look at their religion. It is completely emotion based so any attempt to get them to look rationally feels very threatening and then all that emotion comes out, and it's not pretty. ~Atheist, ex-fundie-Xian, former New Ager
2012-05-20 1:34 am
I never use the suffering of others as proof of a lack of a deity. However, I believe a lot of atheists use it as proof that Christians are spending too much time and money on lesser causes. I'm sure a lot of money is going into campaigning against gay marriage and other issues that should be of very small concern to them in comparison to what's going on in the rest of the world.

Think of all the money, time and resources spent on building churches, printing shiny new Bibles, paying for uniforms of people who work in the Church... If God does exist, I highly doubt he would tell you to spend your money and time on these things over helping others.

I'm not going to tell you there is no God, that is what I believe, as well as not pushing your religion or lack thereof on others. But I am going to tell you that based on reading the Bible, my 9 years in a Catholic school and 17 years of going to church, if there was a God, most Christians are NOT following his word.


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