臨終處理常識 – 取出亡者起搏器問題.

2008-04-24 9:00 am
如果亡者有心臟起搏器, 醫護會在證實死亡之後代他剖出. ( 因為火葬時起搏器會爆.) 這會否影響亡者去向?

理論上應怎處理才最好?

在香港公立醫院實際上又可要求怎處理?
更新1:

智南師兄, 多謝解答. 不用心, 那只是件往事. 想想如果佛子能預早有備, 那便不用太忙亂或遺撼. 這種事總令人忙亂. 愛有念, 我等凡夫有執. 能祝福一點便安樂一點. 當日我沒心理準備, 臨時要像流難醫護的人去拖延解剖, 心情難受之時, 我語言亦不懂柔軟解釋. 而解釋對方亦不一定能明白. 相方亦不好受.

更新2:

可能在危怠預知人不能回轉時, 家人能預早跟醫護溝通臨終安排, 那事情對誰都和諧順利些. 有些甚麼在醫院運作中可行, 有些甚麼不可能……在可能的做到妥善. 據我所知, 學院中有人的宗教信仰須要包頭, 學校的校服規則會包容. 囚犯宗教不能吃豬肉, 食物亦有特別安排. 所以我相信, 宗教知見對亡者的保障, 亦應受尊重. 我也不知可做甚麼, 只是首先希望別人不如我當日的要臨事忙亂.

更新3:

owlsun君, 多謝作答. 你說的也很對, 是科學正見. 還怪我問得不清楚. 那不是亡者還需要起搏器的問題, 而是在現代物質科學和宗教靈識知識之間怎樣尋求一個和諧處理. 很多謝你的關心! 祝如意!

更新4:

智南師兄, 彌海沙師兄, 多謝兩位熱心幫助. 在彌海沙師兄答案啟發後, 我感到原來事情是有可能的, 但與前線醫護對壘不是正確方法. 於是我去信醫管局, 得到如下回覆: (有關查詢病人死匚後, 在處理遺體時, 涉及宗教信仰安排一事, 若病人是在本局轄下醫院逝世, 病人家屬可直接向該院的當值護士或病人聯絡主任提出要求,醫院會因應個別情況而作出適當處理及安排。) 這初步是可喜的, 我會繼續跟進要求醫管局對醫護作出指引, 到時大家便有法可循. 如有進展, 我定會通知大家. 交給投票, 因為想多些有緣人能看到兩位提供的知識! 感謝! 阿彌陀佛!

回答 (3)

2008-04-27 2:10 am
✔ 最佳答案
野人師兄深明大義,晚生致敬。
我是 智南師兄之師弟,由彼師兄處獲教良多。智南師兄慈悲,知晚生在公立醫院工作,故將 野人師兄之問題轉告故晚生。今晚生奉 智南師兄慈命,與 師兄分享晚生的個人經驗。

先來個衷心抱歉,因我的電腦輸入中文字頗有問題,如師兄不介意,晚生以英文回答較為快捷,sorry。

First of all, as a Buddhist and medical field worker, I totally agree with 師兄 and 智南師兄's concept that one should minimise disturbance, even touching (let alone dissecting) the body (遺體) of a just deceased person so long as his 神識 is still lingering around as this may cause agony and provoke evil anger of the decease, resulting him to dive into the hell.

However, 師兄 is correct. Practically this is virtually impossible in public hospital, both for operational and hygiene reason. The body will decay if left at room temperature in the ward for several hours and it will also cause psychological stress to other patients sleeping in adjacent beds or in the same cubicles. In peak season when the hospital bed availability is tight, the bed where a patient had just died will be allocated to another newly admitted patient immediately in some hospitals.


--- to be continued ---

2008-04-26 18:12:59 補充:
As for the removal of METALLIC (金屬) implant(殖入物) (e.g. pacemaker [心臟起搏器] or other cardiac device, orthopedic [科] implants like metallic screw and plate . . . etc), they need to be removed ONLY when they may cause potential explosion during 火葬.

2008-04-26 18:13:26 補充:
Pacemaker [心臟起搏器] may cause explosion so it must be removed before 火葬. The doctor has to issue a certificate (火葬紙) to the relatives and it requires any potential explosive metallic implant to be removed and documented before this 火葬紙 can be issued.

2008-04-26 18:14:05 補充:
So for other metallic implants that is not likely to cause explosion like orthopedic [科] implants, they need NOT be removed and can stay inside the body. So removal of the pacemaker is only a safety requirement for 火葬. If the relatives choose for 土葬, the pacemaker NEED NOT be removed.

2008-04-26 18:14:25 補充:
But since 火葬 is very common nowadays, medical staff will routinely remove the pacemaker once a patient is certified dead as it is better than arousing the body again later in the mortuary to do the dissection after the relatives have chosen the mode of cremation, maybe days afterwards.

2008-04-26 18:15:04 補充:
So, if the patient or the relatives have decided not for 火葬 before the patient was certified dead, they can talk to the hospital staff and request them not to remove the pacemaker.

2008-04-26 18:15:18 補充:
This is totally acceptable and the death certificate (死亡證) will still be issued, only without the 火葬紙 and the deceased will not be entitled to 火葬. 土葬 is perfectly ok with the pacemaker in situ.

2008-04-26 18:15:43 補充:
What happens if the patient or the relatives have decided for 火葬? The pacemaker must be removed by dissection, AFTER the patient was certified dead. It is not ethical to remove the life sustaining pacemaker before a person's death.

2008-04-26 18:15:57 補充:
From a medical point of view, the timing is not of any importance, nor the venue for this procedure, provided that no potentially explosive implants are present the moment the body was 火葬. So the timing is more of operational consideration.

2008-04-26 18:16:16 補充:
I have worked in Catholic (天主教) and government hospitals and the practice is similar, though different hospital, or I should say, different doctors / nurses (the doctor responsible for taking out the implant and the nurse is in charge of the ward hence all the operation).

2008-04-26 18:16:37 補充:
Usually, the doctor will remove the pacemaker at the same setting immediately after he certified the patient and then the nurse will call the mortuary staff to escort the body to the mortuary. The removal will be a 5cm cut over the chest wall where the pacemaker was placed.

2008-04-26 18:16:51 補充:
Some doctors will cut the wire connecting to the heart whilst others would try to pull it out. Then the doctor will suture the wound. No anasthesia (麻醉藥) will be used for any procedures after death.

2008-04-26 18:17:32 補充:
But I have also seen many cases where the pacemaker was removed after the body was sent to the mortuary, even the next day. This is usually due to the nurse has overlooked that a pacemaker was inside the patient's body and it was only discovered when the doctor in charge try to issue the 火葬紙.

2008-04-26 18:18:47 補充:
In that case, the doctor will go to the mortuary to do the removal of the pacemaker. But that time, it can be several hours after the patient's death and by that time the 神識 may not be around to feel the pain.

2008-04-26 18:19:16 補充:
So, in theory, the relatives may requests the pacemaker be removed say only 8 hours after the death and this would normally be done in the mortuary as for reasons mentioned above, it is difficult to keep the body inside the ward for half a day.

2008-04-26 18:20:19 補充:
You of course have to give the reason for this "strange" request but I am not sure how many people would entertain this request. The nurse has to explain this extremely rare arrangement to the mortuary staff.

2008-04-26 18:20:46 補充:
The mortuary staff will naturally not prefer a procedure performed there as this is not the usual practice. Many doctors are reluctant to go alone to the mortuary to do the dissection without any assistants.

2008-04-26 18:21:09 補充:
But technically and theoretically it is possible and medically and ethically acceptable. I expect government hospital will usually more likely turn down this request as they very emphasise on following rules. No bonus for them for doing the extra mercy.

2008-04-26 18:21:25 補充:
I find more love in hospital with religious background. you may approach the Patient Relation Officer (PRO) for help to see if the effect is better. As hospital staff usually "give face" to the PRO as PRO are actually the complaint officer! Hospital staff tend to avoid complaints!

2008-04-26 18:21:49 補充:
I have colleagues working in private hospital. The flexibility is much much greater in private hospital. As mentioned, delaying the dissection is actually medically acceptable, so private hospitals usually will not turn down relatives' requests unless unreasonable.

2008-04-26 18:22:02 補充:
It may also be possible for the body to stay in the ward as long as possible and the dissection be done at the bedside a few hours later after the death. But there may be extra charges for special arrangement.

野人師兄既關心早亡親友又深明大義,晚生敬佩。

南無阿彌陀佛!
參考: My experience
2008-05-07 6:45 am
多謝 彌海沙師兄慈悲, 詳盡解答. 後學獲益良多!

有興趣認識多些臨終照顧的朋友亦可參看以下彌海沙師兄之專業評論: 關於臨終者打嗎啡.
http://hk.knowledge.yahoo.com/question/article?qid=6908050502314

2008-06-02 20:57:07 補充:
醫管局兩封回應轉載於:

http://hk.myblog.yahoo.com/monkey-me/article?mid=300
2008-04-25 5:53 am
佛教認為,常人的神識在死後8小時才完全離開軀體。在這期間不可觸動遺體,因神識極為敏感脆弱,一撫一觸都會痛如刀割,若解剖遺體更會劇痛難忍。故華人佛教通常建議在人死後8小時內不動遺體,親友不斷念佛迥向,有的更持續至12或24小時。
對於這種人力難以控制之事,人們總是盡力多做,不少做。故即使現時未有太多實在科學研究證據,人們也從善如流以盡心意。
至於本港醫院制度可否配合,則待有經驗的師兄分享。
附:臨終文集 http://book.bfnn.org/article_22.htm
阿彌陀佛。


2008-04-28 19:58:06 補充:
彌海沙師兄公務繁忙,撥空來指導專業意見,利益有緣人,阿彌陀佛。

野人師兄和彌海沙師兄均具赤子仁心,是後學衷心敬重的善知識。菩提路迢迢漫漫,大家有緣萍水相識,相扶共進,實為人生快事: )


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